Carnosaur
MemberCompsognathusAug-14-2014 6:24 PMToday, we look at the most intact Spinosaurid known, and one of my personal favorites.
Suchomimus is known from several partially complete individuals, and from that we have more to work with, versus, oxalaia which we have very little of.
But, first we take on the controversial issue of this individual being a subadult animal.
if I remember correctly, no where in Sereno et al. 1998 says that the Suchomimus holotype is subadult, Holt'z list 12m, why? I don't know, Sereno said "around 11m" in his typical vague fashion, Hartman's skeletal is 11.8m though. I have yet to read anything on cervical vertabrate being unfused, or any bones that were unearthed for that matter. Unfused bone is characteristic of immature animals, so this is usually what we look for.
From a paper released recently after Suchomimus' discovery in '97(lengths are in milimeters):
| Bone | Suchomimus | Baryonyx | Allosaurus |
|---|---|---|---|
| Lengths | |||
| Humerus | 560 | 483* | 310 |
| Radius | 255 | 225 | 222 |
| Metacarpal III | 130 | ? | 101 |
| I | 190 | 173* | 102 |
| II | 165 | ? | 92 |
| III | 120 | 120* | 54 |
| Femur | 1075 | ? | 850 |
| Tibia | 945 | ? | 690 |
| Ratios | |||
| Radius/humerus | 0.46 | 0.47 | 0.72 |
| I/radius | 0.75 | 0.77 | 0.46 |
| II/I | 0.87 | ? | 0.90 |
| III/I | 0.63 | 0.69 | 0.53 |
| Tibia/femur | 0.88 | ? | |
With these numbers, we can tell it was already larger then both height and perhaps length. Spinosaurs, being moderately built animals, weren't record breakers weight wise. Suchomimus doesn't appear to be as gracile as baryonyx, and it being a couple meters longer and a bit more robustly built we can say with the uttermost certainty that Suchomimus was a tad bit larger.
Piecing the skull fragments together, Suchomimus had a skull just under four feet in lenght. (1,2 m or 3 ft 11,25 in)
the 1:8 ratio designed for theropods(what i've referred to as the eights rule constantly here),
3.8 x 8 yields~ 30.4 feet.
That just seems off to me, and consulting Scott Hartman on DeviantArt, i've come to the conclusion that this ratio doesn't fit too well with the spinosaurids.
Femur/ weight ratio provides a TBW of 3.4 tons
Baryonyx weighed approximately 2 tons, and is considered a subadult as well(i'll get to that guy later)
Scaling up a baryonyx to 11 meters, provides us with 3.76 tons.
Having no other relatively close(or reasonably intact) spinosaurs to base off of, this is what we have.
Overall, Suchomimus Tenerensis was roughly 11.5 meters in length, and tipped the scales at 3-4 tons.
Nature doesn't deceive us; it is we who deceive ourselves.
Sci-Fi King25
MemberAllosaurusAug-14-2014 6:27 PMI agree with your estimates. Nice choice to do the size of.
“Banana oil.”- George Takei, Gigantis: The Fire Monster
Hiphopananomus
MemberCompsognathusAug-14-2014 6:41 PMI agree with those estimates.
"Somewhere on this island is the greatest predator that ever lived. Second greatest predator must take him down."Roland Tembo"
"Jurassic park: The Lost World"
Carnosaur
MemberCompsognathusAug-14-2014 6:55 PMSucho has been a long time in the making for the series...
@Predator x - i'm not too sure. The one's i've done recently weren't even slotted to make an appearance in this series...do you have any suggestions?
Nature doesn't deceive us; it is we who deceive ourselves.
Carnosaur
MemberCompsognathusAug-14-2014 7:02 PMother then what i've covered?
I plan to do:
Torvosaurus
Alamosaurus
Eotriceratops
Deinocheirus
Saurophaganax
Chilantaisaurus
....And whatever you guys want to see!
Nature doesn't deceive us; it is we who deceive ourselves.
Hiphopananomus
MemberCompsognathusAug-14-2014 7:04 PMThought you were doing Shantungosaurus next? And for suggestions
myabe, titanoceratops?
"Somewhere on this island is the greatest predator that ever lived. Second greatest predator must take him down."Roland Tembo"
"Jurassic park: The Lost World"
Carnosaur
MemberCompsognathusAug-14-2014 7:09 PMi was gonna do shantungosaurus a hell of a long time ago....and titanoceratops is a good one too..
Shantungosaurus tomorrow? unless you guys wanna see something different, of course
Nature doesn't deceive us; it is we who deceive ourselves.
Hiphopananomus
MemberCompsognathusAug-14-2014 7:10 PMI'd like shantungo tomrow, always found it a bit hard to decide a size for it.
"Somewhere on this island is the greatest predator that ever lived. Second greatest predator must take him down."Roland Tembo"
"Jurassic park: The Lost World"
Allotitan
MemberCompsognathusAug-14-2014 8:33 PMGood post as always Carnosaur
as a suggestion how about Tyrannotitan, Bahariasaurus, and Piatnitzkysaurus
When life gives you lemons, don't make lemonade. Tell life I don't want you're damn lemons, and then squeeze them into life's eyes!
Lord Vader
MemberTyrannosaurus RexAug-15-2014 5:04 AMNice job on this, agreeable estimate. I don't have any suggestions.
Jack of all trades. Master of none
Rex Fan 684
MemberCompsognathusAug-15-2014 6:47 AMNice. I always found the "adult" 12 meter long, 5-7 ton estimates people throw out there, uh, troubling. I see 11 meters and 3.5 tons as very reasonable(that's what I have on my site).
Suggestions, I'd like to see more herbivores. We've been seeing a ton of carnivores. But I'd love to see Ceratosaurus. Maybe Ceratosaurus could be done(I don't think you did Ceratosaurus yet at least).
Dr. Alan Grant
MemberCompsognathusAug-15-2014 4:12 PMPretty nice topic Carnosaur. To some extend I agree with everything you have stated but there are some stuff I want you to see:
Check this Suchomimus skeleton out:
As you can see, they were fairly bulky creatures. I think it averaged a weight of 3-5 tons. As for the holotype specimen of a sub-adult 11m Suchomimus, I heard it's bones were not fully mature. Just my 2 cents
Carnosaur
MemberCompsognathusAug-15-2014 5:06 PMThey were robust for Spinosaurid standards. When i first saw a the display at my local museum my first thought was "damn"...and that's it haha..
I too heard the caudal vertabrate weren't completely fused(hinting at a subadult on the onset of maturity), i even vaguely remember reading it in Sereno's initial description of the animal, but i can't find anything of the sort any where nowadays..which is weird.
a 12 meter Sucho isn't outside the realm of possibility, not by a long shot and a twelve meter animal would have little trouble weighing 4-5 tons
Nature doesn't deceive us; it is we who deceive ourselves.
Dr. Alan Grant
MemberCompsognathusAug-17-2014 12:25 PMWas exactly my reaction when I say a Suchomimus as well! Don't know why people kept saying they were fragile built because that isn't true.
Exactly, I do wonder if other papers were mentioned in Suchomimus part. I still have not found any of them but that's maybe because I was never looking that often haha.
Agreed.
